Detail resolution of data

Mate3 and Mate3s communications devices for Outback Power
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JRHill
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Detail resolution of data

Post by JRHill » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:09 pm

Hi Folks,

I've got a phantom load of around 600 watts that is intermittent and for a short 1-5 minutes as best I can tell. I'm having trouble tracking the source of the load. I've disconnected things here and there but it's been illusive so far. What worries me is it could be one of the deep freezers or the fridge/freezer. I would think if any of those units were failing I would have obvious indications in temperature performance. The failure would be terrible, obviously. So I can't disconnect them and even if I did, I'd have to be inside or close by to catch the correlation with them kicking in with the load.

I was looking to see if I could increase the resolution of graphing in OpticsRE to see how often and when this is occurring. Nope - its by the day at the finest. The only other way is the Mate SD card but that is curious with all the separate files. I have a Kill-A-Watt for device specific load but that doesn't give me any resolution either. One last hint: when I caught this happening this early AM when I was in bed and it was causing the EU7000 to surge. I ran down stairs to look at the Mate3 and it was showing the draw - if it was the generator it wouldn't show on the Mate3.

In our small place I have two 15a light circuits and three 20a outlet circuits. I doubt its a lighting branch. So somewhere in the 20a outlet branches there is a problem device/circuit. And to cause the EU7000 to surge really concerns me, esp at only 600 watts extra. It has never flinched at varying or surge loads much greater than this phantom.

Suggestions? Hints?

Best, Jim

provo
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by provo » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:17 pm

JRHill wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:09 pm
Hi Folks,

I've got a phantom load of around 600 watts that is intermittent and for a short 1-5 minutes as best I can tell. I'm having trouble tracking the source of the load. I've disconnected things here and there but it's been illusive so far. What worries me is it could be one of the deep freezers or the fridge/freezer.
You've probably eliminated this, but it sounds a lot like the defrost cycle on my fridge. In my case 400W for 20 min, maybe twice a day.
5 min. seems short for a defrost, though....

JRHill
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by JRHill » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:45 pm

provo wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:17 pm
JRHill wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:09 pm
Hi Folks,

I've got a phantom load of around 600 watts that is intermittent and for a short 1-5 minutes as best I can tell. I'm having trouble tracking the source of the load. I've disconnected things here and there but it's been illusive so far. What worries me is it could be one of the deep freezers or the fridge/freezer.
You've probably eliminated this, but it sounds a lot like the defrost cycle on my fridge. In my case 400W for 20 min, maybe twice a day.
5 min. seems short for a defrost, though....
Thx Provo. This is new - just happened in the last 3 days. There have been no new connections or usage in that time.

raysun
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by raysun » Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:48 pm

If you wish to entertain a monitoring method so kludgy that MacGyver would be 🙄, you might try this:

On a laptop, pc, or phone that can support a screen capture, bring up the Mate web site, which doesn't display graphs, but displays the status with real-time updates.

If a time-lapse app is used, recordings can be set to ~ 1 minute resolution to keep file sizes down, and playback shorter.

JRHill
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by JRHill » Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:16 pm

I've logged into the Mate many times with the IP. Your suggestion was superb. Now it errors out. Haaa. Like many other projects ya get into the weeds and then ask 'What was I gonna do?' I'll figure it out. Thanks for that suggestion Raysun!

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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by sodamo » Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:48 am

Have you looked at the 15 minute Optics report?
David
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JRHill
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by JRHill » Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:09 pm

sodamo wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:48 am
Have you looked at the 15 minute Optics report?
Thx Mr. Sodamo. Good one. I pulled the report during an overnight instance of the surging and failure of an AGS run on 9.17.2020.

Event Description Timestamp
Automatic Generator Start (AGS) Run has Failed.

Nothing in the 15min report registered during the time frame.

Sigh. I pulled the Error Log and it is empty. I've ordered a fuel filter and a spare but if it malfunctioned like this I should've gotten an E-0A. While changing the filter I will drain and clean the tank. Using fresh premium unleaded. The station with non-ethanol fuel quit carrying it - grrrr.

Still investigating. It IS the generator cause in I take it completely off line it is still surging. I'll let y'all know how it comes out.

Best, JRH

plebspamuser
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by plebspamuser » Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:34 pm

Jim,

I realise that wattplot is probably abandonware at the moment, but I think it may help you out especially if you have an fndc connected. Under Penplots if you go to the FNDC option you should be able to get a second by second (or minute by minute) snapshot of your system with resolution of .1 of an amp (2.4 watts on a 24 volt system and 4.8 on 48 watt system)... It will also show you exactly what time you have these jumps and for how long... Unfortunate that optics does not allow this type of resolution.. I hope this helps
pleb

JRHill
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by JRHill » Fri Sep 18, 2020 1:44 pm

plebspamuser wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:34 pm
Jim,

I realise that wattplot is probably abandonware at the moment, but I think it may help you out especially if you have an fndc connected. Under Penplots if you go to the FNDC option you should be able to get a second by second (or minute by minute) snapshot of your system with resolution of .1 of an amp (2.4 watts on a 24 volt system and 4.8 on 48 watt system)... It will also show you exactly what time you have these jumps and for how long... Unfortunate that optics does not allow this type of resolution.. I hope this helps
pleb
I used WattPlot for a long time. Loved it. But I lost everything twice due to hardware failures. Yeah, I could've done better with backups but when something works I tend to leave it alone. I love the cloud solution after all that. If a hw/sw failure all the data is still there. Plus another biggie, I can't do WattPlot and Optics at the same time. But I appreciate what you are suggesting.

plebspamuser
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by plebspamuser » Sat Sep 19, 2020 11:38 am

Yes I know what you mean... Actually I suppose Im a bit lucky for purchasing the old usb card a few years ago when it was available on the older mate3. I use the usbcard to control wattplot while the ethernet connects to optics.. I was surprised that they both work at the same time actually but it does give the best of both worlds - both online data and detailed local monitoring plus control.. Its a shame that the usb card was dropped and no other option is available for us to use with the same functionality..
just my 0.02c
pleb

JRHill
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Re: Detail resolution of data

Post by JRHill » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:26 am

JRHill wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:09 pm
And to cause the EU7000 to surge really concerns me, esp at only 600 watts extra. It has never flinched at varying or surge loads much greater than this phantom.
The surging of the generator seems to be solved. Per the manual the spark arrestor has two screens that need to be inspected and cleaned. With a flashlight I can see two screens in the tip without disassembly and both have always been clear so I haven't ever disassembled it. But to be clear, there are two screen "pieces." The tip is one piece and has 'two' screens. The other piece is conical and of much finer mesh that extends into the muffler. You'd not know without removing the spark arrestor tip and sticking a finger into the exhaust outlet. That screen was mostly plugged after 1400hrs.

The generator didn't log any errors under this condition.

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