HBX

Discussion about OutBack Inverters in Backup Applications

Moderators: OutBack Moderator Team, OutBack

HBX

Postby rjohnson54 on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:14 pm

I scrapped the idea of setting up my system as a mini-grid. Once it tripped and started using grid power it would not go back to using the
inverter to power loads even though the battries are fully charge. So following a call to tech support I set up HBX on the mate3 and the
inverter is set up in backup mode. Now the system won't use the inverter to power loads unless I switch off the grid power breaker.
I just want a system that uses the grid when the batteries are too low. But the rest of the time I want to fully exploit
my 7kw pv array.

gs8048 inverter
mate3
rjohnson54
Forum Junior Member
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 11:54 am
Location: Central Iowa
My RE system: Radian GS8048
2- Flexmax 80
Mate 3
24 280 watt PV panels
2 strings of 8 420 ah flooded batteries

Re: HBX

Postby Solar Jason on Sun Jan 12, 2014 3:13 pm

Do you have a grid tie agreement with your power company that allows you to run the meter backwards when you produce excess energy? If so to make the most of your solar array, you should be set up as a grid tie system. If your meter won't spin backwards, then you should use HBX and have it use the grid when you are down to 50% and stop using the grid when you are back to 99 or 100% (assuming you calibrated you flexnet dc). You will be wasting solar energy once you reach the absorb voltage set point if you don't have a dump load, but if you can't push back to the grid, that is what you get.
Solar Jason
Forum Guru
 
Posts: 108
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:58 pm

Re: HBX

Postby tallgirl on Wed Jan 22, 2014 7:21 pm

Unless there is something funky with the Radians, HBX is fairly straight-forward to set up. HOWEVER, a lot of people get HBX setup wrong and find that it won't turn on or what turn off. That's usually an HBX configuration problem.

Best advice is start over from scratch and make sure the Mate 3 is showing the correct state when you think you're done.

FWIW, I have run HBX for a while when I used to fight with my utility over the feed-in-tariff, but I have a twin stack of GVFX 3648's ...
Julie in Texas

I ride bicycles. A lot.
User avatar
tallgirl
Forum Emperor
 
Posts: 4334
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 9:59 am
Location: Austin, TX
My RE system: 16 Kyocera KC175GT (2,800 watts DC), MX-60, 2 OutBack GVFX3648, 8 GC2 batteries (6v @ 215AH),

Re: HBX

Postby rjohnson54 on Wed Mar 12, 2014 9:28 am

I recently had an Equipment failure of my Radian. Outback customer support was great. They walked me through some diagnostics. Determined it was indeed an equipment problem and promptly sent the needed parts. I got everything up and going and updated all the firmware. HBX seems to be working like a charm now.
rjohnson54
Forum Junior Member
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 11:54 am
Location: Central Iowa
My RE system: Radian GS8048
2- Flexmax 80
Mate 3
24 280 watt PV panels
2 strings of 8 420 ah flooded batteries

Re: HBX

Postby tallgirl on Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:05 pm

I'm going to say this as clearly as I know how --

If you have a feed-in tariff agreement with your utility that pays at least 75% or so of the cost of the energy you're buying, HBX is a mistake. The only other application where HBX might make sense is if you are on a TOU tariff and you can set up HBX so you beat high TOU rates some part of the day, without sulfating your batteries.

A properly designed off-grid system, which is what is required to use HBX long-term (short-term it's just a way to sulfate batteries ...), is about 50 to 55 percent efficient, end-to-end. A well designed battery backed system, with AGM batteries to reduce various losses, can be as high as 80 to 85 percent efficient, end-to-end. That's it -- I've spent the past 7 years monitoring the living daylights out of PV systems -- off-grid, backup-only, battery-backed, straight grid-tie -- and that's what you get. The DC PV part of my system, which has been tuned within an inch of its life, is about 75% efficient because I have flooded batteries.

When I developed the "gmManage" application for my software (greenMonitor) I put it to very good use. I had greatly reduced bills, not a lot of selling back to the grid, but I "spilled" more energy a day than it was worth. My system is plenty robust -- I've made my living for the past 5 years on PV monitoring and control applications and there's just no way to get around that fundamental difference in system efficiency. More to the point, every single last time you start discharging batteries you are contributing to some potential for sulfate build-up.
Julie in Texas

I ride bicycles. A lot.
User avatar
tallgirl
Forum Emperor
 
Posts: 4334
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 9:59 am
Location: Austin, TX
My RE system: 16 Kyocera KC175GT (2,800 watts DC), MX-60, 2 OutBack GVFX3648, 8 GC2 batteries (6v @ 215AH),

Re: HBX

Postby Guydav on Mon Oct 30, 2017 2:35 pm

Hi Tall Girl, I have read your posts for years, I am interested on your take on this.

I have just installed an "off Grid" system. The elderly client refused the option of a diesel generator because of fossil fuel issues!
I therefore set the system up using "HBX" the grid connection being "Grid Neutral" that is, only being used to charge the batteries when they reach the defined state of discharge and cut out when the batteries are restored to the defined state of charge. All consumer power being supplied through the outback system.

It all worked flawlessley for 6 weeks, when the slave inverter failed for some reason.

Outback have been involved with the warranty replacement of the slave inverter, and for some reason they are pushing the "Minigrid" and are having issues setting the modes without the system shutting down.

Why would they do this as it is not the intention of the customer to sell to the grid. Is there an established issue with "HBX"
if not, in this situation why not stick with "HBX"?
Guydav
Forum Member
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2011 4:17 am
Location: Riwaka New Zealand
My RE system: Outback Flexware 500 system,
1 x Mx 60 charge controller.
1 x Flex max 80 charge controller
1 x Hub 10. 1 x Mate.
1.1 KW static solar array.
12 Sanyo panels 2.820 KW on 2 axis tracker.
750 amp/Hr 48 volt battery bank
10 Kva Diesel Generator
1 Remote Temperature Sender (RTS).
Flexnet DC


Return to Backup Applications

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests