Generator hook-up not working

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Ponderosa
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My RE system: Radian fpr-4048-01 Honda eu7000is generator

Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:39 am

I am having trouble with my Radian 4048A-01 system recognizing my Honda EU7000is generator. I am wondering if I have wired it up incorrectly. I am coming off the 30 amp plug with 2 wires and a ground. So with the three prongs on the plug, I have the black going to L1, the white going to L2 and the ground wire to the ground bar. I notice on the wiring diagram there is a neutral wire running from the generator to the neutral bar. What's that all about? Now I am wondering if this missing neutral wire is the issue and if so where would it connect to the plug?? Could the neutral wire be the one I have to connect to the the third prong on the plug where I have the ground wire connected Can anyone who has hooked up a generator, specifically a Honda 7000 tell me how they did it?
Last edited by Ponderosa on Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:35 am, edited 2 times in total.

raysun
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:06 am

The EU7000is operates in either 120V or 120/240V mode, switch selectable.

The 30A, 3-prong connector is 120V single phase only. The 120/240V section of the outlet array on the front panel has a 4-prong connector that provides 240V split phase when the generator is switched to 120/240V mode.

I'd highly recommend a careful read of the manual regarding the output operation modes. The EU7000is is smart about protecting itself, but there are conditions that could lead to needing to replace very expensive inverter boards.

fcwlp
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by fcwlp » Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:20 am

And use a voltmeter to verify the voltages.

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:49 am

Thanks for the replies. I have amended my post slightly with a more accurate description of the connection from the 3-pronged outlet to the load center. Raysun, you mentioned the four prong two phase plug 120/240. Are you suggesting that the inverter only recognizes two phase current? or are you saying that I need to have the 120/240 switch turned off before the 3 pronged single phase plug will work, and that the inverter is ok with single phase power coming from the generator. By the way when I manually turn the generator on the Generator icon at the bottom right hand corner of the Mate3 registers 134Vac. But the yellow light blinks indicating that the connection is just not right.
.

raysun
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:12 pm

Ponderosa wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:49 am
Thanks for the replies. I have amended my post slightly with a more accurate description of the connection from the 3-pronged outlet to the load center. Raysun, you mentioned the four prong two phase plug 120/240. Are you suggesting that the inverter only recognizes two phase current? or are you saying that I need to have the 120/240 switch turned off before the 3 pronged single phase plug will work, and that the inverter is ok with single phase power coming from the generator. By the way when I manually turn the generator on the Generator icon at the bottom right hand corner of the Mate3 registers 134Vac. But the yellow light blinks indicating that the connection is just not right.
.
The generator is capable of 120V single phase (Hot, Neutral, and Ground), or 240V split phase (L1 Hot, L2 Hot, Neutral, and Ground). In 240V split phase, each Hot (L1, L2) is 120V with respect to Neutral.

In the wiring scheme you describe, the black wire (120V hot) is connected to L1 (hot) on the inverter's AC IN. The white wire (Neutral) is connected to L2 (hot) on the inverter's AC IN. This wiring scheme will not give the L1-N-L2 240V split phase the inverter is expecting, so the AC IN will not be connected.

You need to have a line cord rated at 30A with an L14-30R 4-pole twist-lock plug at the generator, connected to the 240V outlet. The wiring will be Black (L1 hot), White (Neutral), Red (L2 hot), and Green (ground). Wire the leads properly into the GSLC, and AC IN will connect without issue.

Make sure the generator voltage switch is set to 120/240V (not 120V only.)

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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by sodamo » Fri Sep 18, 2020 3:45 pm

Am assuming you have power at generator (check breaker)
Check Mate AC input is active. You only get. Yellow like if not On as I recall.
David
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Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:46 pm

Thanks for the info . I am thinking that running a 3 wire #10 from the four prong socket will do the trick. Shall pick up a 4 pole twist lock plug and give it a try.

raysun
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:56 pm

Ponderosa wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:46 pm
Thanks for the info . I am thinking that running a 3 wire #10 from the four prong socket will do the trick. Shall pick up a 4 pole twist lock plug and give it a try.
Hmmm.... planning on leaving the circuit ungrounded?

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Mon Sep 21, 2020 7:30 am

The plug will have a ground as well. Four prong- Black-hot Red- hot White- neutral and the ground wire.

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:04 pm

Raysun: followed your instructions, and generator is working perfect.... Thx for the help.

raysun
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Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:40 pm

Ponderosa wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:04 pm
Raysun: followed your instructions, and generator is working perfect.... Thx for the help.
YW.

BruceS
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by BruceS » Sat Oct 24, 2020 6:34 pm

Once again we need to note this only applies to the USA version of the Honda genny.
Only 230v AC single phase in Australia. (3 outlets all connected together internally)

raysun
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Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Sat Oct 24, 2020 6:54 pm

BruceS wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 6:34 pm
Once again we need to note this only applies to the USA version of the Honda genny.
Only 230v AC single phase in Australia. (3 outlets all connected together internally)
Is that two-pole single phase, or split phase with common neutral? With negative ground either way?

OP was asking about a Honda EU7000is. Is the Oz version the EU70is?

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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by BruceS » Sat Oct 24, 2020 7:11 pm

I'm not an electrician but ....
I think 2 pole single phase? Live, Neutral & earth ..... 3 X 3 pin 15A sockets.
Yes it's the same model numbers ... EU7000is.

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:24 pm

I have a new problem that I hope someone can help me with. I have started my generator several times when I needed to get the batteries up. Seems to work well until last time I tried it. It ran for about 10 minutes showing around 3400 watts coming in from the generator and then the inverter light went off, and the red error light came on. Details of the error said AC input short. So I turned the generator off and reset the inverter It came on for a second and then went off again as the red error light came on. I tried a couple of times with the same result. Then I unplugged the wire from the generator to the inverter and then tried resetting the inverter. It worked! And the power came back on. Next I went back to the generator which of course is still off, and I put the plug back in. Immediately all the power went out. Took the plug back out and reset the inverter and I have power again. Now what do I do? Is the problem the generator, the plug or the Outback charger/inverter unit? Anyone have any ideas???

raysun
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Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:31 pm

Ponderosa wrote:
Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:24 pm
I have a new problem that I hope someone can help me with. I have started my generator several times when I needed to get the batteries up. Seems to work well until last time I tried it. It ran for about 10 minutes showing around 3400 watts coming in from the generator and then the inverter light went off, and the red error light came on. Details of the error said AC input short. So I turned the generator off and reset the inverter It came on for a second and then went off again as the red error light came on. I tried a couple of times with the same result. Then I unplugged the wire from the generator to the inverter and then tried resetting the inverter. It worked! And the power came back on. Next I went back to the generator which of course is still off, and I put the plug back in. Immediately all the power went out. Took the plug back out and reset the inverter and I have power again. Now what do I do? Is the problem the generator, the plug or the Outback charger/inverter unit? Anyone have any ideas???
A common problem is shorting in the plug wiring. What is the NEMA plug designation?

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Tue Oct 27, 2020 3:51 pm

Not sure of the nema designation. I sent a picture to a local electrician and he said he had what I needed, so I purchased it from him. It is a 30A 1125/250V locking plug. The strange thing about it is that there is no problem when the plug is just hanging there not connected to the generator. As soon as I plug it into the generator a short is created. If there was a short in the plug, which incidentally I wired myself, then wouldn't I get the error message with it just hanging there? Why only when it is plugged into the generator??? (generator not turned on)

raysun
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Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by raysun » Tue Oct 27, 2020 3:56 pm

Just hanging there, AC IN is disconnected, (and that's a good thing for safety). When the AC IN circuit is energized, it connects to the inverter.

I'd start by opening the plug and giving the wiring a quick inspection.

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:40 am

Wiring is ok. Error message reads short ac output. when I plugged in the cable the last time there was a slight sparking as the prongs were being pushed into the generator connection. And then of course the power went off. I am going to open up the inverter panel now and check the connections inside there.

Ponderosa
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by Ponderosa » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:32 am

I just plugged it into another generator and it is working fine, so I guess it's the brand new generator that I bought. Thanks to you people that replied.

fcwlp
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Re: Generator hook-up not working

Post by fcwlp » Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:32 pm

Is the error and "AC Output Shorted" or "AC Input Shorted" as you have used both terms? The operator's manual only shows an "AC Output Shorted" error.

An "AC Output Shorted" error suggests that there is something wrong on the output side of the inverter. Manual also says it could be do a large overload situation. I had one customer with a VFXR that had an AC Output Shorted error, turned out the inverter was much quicker to react than the customer's circuit breaker. It took awhile to find the issue.

Given that one generator works and the other does not is interesting. I would recommend, undoing your connection to the inverter and measuring the voltages while the generator is running to confirm that you have 240V between L1 & L2 and 120V between each leg and neutral.

The Honda EU7000 does not have the Neutral and Ground bonded (connected) together, which is what you want. The N and G should only be bonded at one point in the system. You do not state if you are grid-tied or off grid but given your gen use I expect you are off grid. If grid-tied, the bond is made at the service entrance, usually in first load panel past the meter. If off-grid it should be made in the Radian's GSLC. The Radian GSLC ships with the Neutral bar bonded to the case which is at ground potential. If you are grid-tied, you should remove this bond as explained on p.34 of the GSLC installation manual.

What is the model of generator that works? Do you know if the N & G are bonded?

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