Charging Only From Solar

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mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:14 am

Hello,

I want my batteries to charge only from solar power. I am presently using the MATE3 in mini grid mode. It does a good job at connecting to the grid when the batteries are drained in the middle of the night; however, when I wake up in the morning, the batteries are fully charged and the inverter is using the AC input from the grid. I have to manually force the inverter to drop the AC connection.

I had much the same problem with (HBX) high battery transfer mode.

Any ideas how to resolve this?

Jordan

raysun
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Posts: 3030
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by raysun » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:31 am

The Inverter Charger has two settings: MODE and CHARGER AC LIMIT.

Setting MODE to OFF should do the trick.

If not set CHARGER AC LIMIT to 0.

provo
Forum Czar
Posts: 534
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:34 pm
My RE system: Sixteen Evergreen EC-120
(4 strings, total 1920W)
Eight Rolls S-550 (2 strings, total ~800Ah @ 24V)
One FM80
One VFXR3524A
Hub 10
Mate3s
FNDC and Trimetric
Location: Sierra foothills

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by provo » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:37 am

mcbainjj wrote:
Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:14 am
Hello,

I want my batteries to charge only from solar power. I am presently using the MATE3 in mini grid mode. It does a good job at connecting to the grid when the batteries are drained in the middle of the night; however, when I wake up in the morning, the batteries are fully charged and the inverter is using the AC input from the grid. I have to manually force the inverter to drop the AC connection.

I had much the same problem with (HBX) high battery transfer mode.
Please fill out your profile with a complete description of all components and how they are wired. Tell us about your panels, and also your typical loads. The obvious approach is to try to charge in the day, and go the entire night on batteries. Where do you live? Is your stated goal even possible in the winter, or is this just a summer goal?

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:41 am

"Charger Control" = OFF was in the top right corner. I didn't see. Thanks for the advice.

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:45 am

I have 12 mission Solar MSE PERC360 Solar Panels (4.3kW)
Outback Flex Power Two FXFR including loadcenter, FM80, MATE3, and HUB4
2 x Relion 24V/100Ah batteries

Everything is on my tiny house with a grid connection. I can run the air conditioner until about 1am at which point the low battery status triggers the grid connection. I want the inverter to use the grid connection to power my house when the battery is low. When the sun comes out, I'd like the inverter to use the sun to charge the battery and support as much of the house's load as possible.

Thanks

raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 3030
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by raysun » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:51 am

mcbainjj wrote:
Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:45 am

I want the inverter to use the grid connection to power my house when the battery is low. When the sun comes out, I'd like the inverter to use the sun to charge the battery and support as much of the house's load as possible.

Thanks
Not to put too fine a point on it, but when the sun comes out, you want the charge controller, not the inverter, to charge the battery.

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:52 am

Fine points are important. Thanks :)

provo
Forum Czar
Posts: 534
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:34 pm
My RE system: Sixteen Evergreen EC-120
(4 strings, total 1920W)
Eight Rolls S-550 (2 strings, total ~800Ah @ 24V)
One FM80
One VFXR3524A
Hub 10
Mate3s
FNDC and Trimetric
Location: Sierra foothills

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by provo » Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:22 am

mcbainjj wrote:
Fri Jul 03, 2020 9:52 am
Fine points are important. Thanks :)
What are the exact model numbers of the two inverters? FXFR is not valid -- VFXR or FXR, followed by some numbers and possibly a letter, would be.

Are your 24V Relion batteries in series (a 48V pack), or in parallel (a 24V pack)? Do you have one FM80 or two?

Depending on the answer, your FM80's may be seeing too much power from the panels for the charge controller and/or for the batteries.

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:04 pm

One FlexNet DC
Two FM80-150VDC
Two INV VFXR3524A

The system was professionally installed so I expect (hope?) that what you've said isn't an issue. I was off-grid with it when it was installed and I've since moved my tiny house and I am operating it under mini-grid now (with a grid connection).

Thanks

provo
Forum Czar
Posts: 534
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:34 pm
My RE system: Sixteen Evergreen EC-120
(4 strings, total 1920W)
Eight Rolls S-550 (2 strings, total ~800Ah @ 24V)
One FM80
One VFXR3524A
Hub 10
Mate3s
FNDC and Trimetric
Location: Sierra foothills

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by provo » Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:20 pm

mcbainjj wrote:
Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:04 pm
One FlexNet DC
Two FM80-150VDC
Two INV VFXR3524A

The system was professionally installed so I expect (hope?) that what you've said isn't an issue. I was off-grid with it when it was installed and I've since moved my tiny house and I am operating it under mini-grid now (with a grid connection).
4320W is 180A at 24V, so each of your FM80's could be required to output 90A, or even more in some conditions. The FM80 is only rated up to 80A at 24V (actually 2000W of panels into each FM80 at 24Vnom), so you are pushing it a bit, and possibly voiding any warranties that might otherwise still be valid.

edit -- each FM80 will only output 80A, so supplying it with enough PV to output 90A (if it could) forces the FM to dissipate the additional input power as heat, which can stress the FM....

Also, each of your batteries has a 100A max charging current, and 50A recommended, so 80A into each battery might be pushing your batteries a bit also.

As far as your original question, I've done a trick with HBX to accomplish something similar. You set the connect voltage at the lowest you want your battery to go during the night, and you set the disconnect voltage higher than the battery will ever get. It's like setting a "latch" -- the grid will come on once when needed, and then not turn off until you do it manually in the morning.

If, when it switches to grid, you want it to charge the batteries back up also, that can be set up in the charging settings for the inverters.

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Fri Jul 03, 2020 6:08 pm

That's a good idea. Thanks for the feedback on my setup. I guess the installer may have pushed the limits a bit. Perhaps he has settings to prevent the issue you described?

Jordan

headsavers
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My RE system: Aquired

Just helping friend with aquired Outback components:
1- Inverter/Charger VFXR3648A

2-SOLAR CHARGER FLEX mAX 80

16-SLA BATTERY 12 VOLYS, 250AH

12-LG365Q1C-A5 365WATT SOLAR MODULES

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by headsavers » Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:36 am

Will the FlexMax 80 recognize the battery bank voltage and automatically set the correct parameters, like bulk, float and tricle charge ?

raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 3030
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower Two: (2) FXR3048A, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
SimpliPhi 48-3.8 (6 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by raysun » Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:18 am

headsavers wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:36 am
Will the FlexMax 80 recognize the battery bank voltage and automatically set the correct parameters, like bulk, float and tricle charge ?
Might be best to start another thread so answers don't get confused. The FM80 does autosense voltage, but doesn't necessarily set the correct voltages and times for the Absorb and Float stages, which are battery dependent. Also, it will not automatically set maximum charging current for the Bulk phase, should the battery require lower than the FM80s maximum of 80A.

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:48 pm

New problem, same strain:

The batteries do not charge off the AC input but when solar power is available and the battery has charged, the grid connection does not turn off. Any thoughts?

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EA6LE-ONE
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Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by EA6LE-ONE » Mon Jul 06, 2020 1:08 pm

mcbainjj wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:48 pm
New problem, same strain:

The batteries do not charge off the AC input but when solar power is available and the battery has charged, the grid connection does not turn off. Any thoughts?
Check if HBX is enabled and if the voltage is reaching the disconnect voltage. Also check the time delay and set it at what delay you desire once the disconnect voltage is achieved. if you want the batteries to be fully charged before switching the inverter on, then set the voltage .2V lower than the absorb voltage and the delay for the absorb time.

mcbainjj
Forum Member
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:05 pm
My RE system: OUTBACK FLEX POWER TWO FXFR INCLUDING LOADCENTER, FM80, MATE3, AND HUB4
2 – RELION 24V/100Ah BATTERIES WITH ALL REQUIRED CABELING

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by mcbainjj » Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:00 pm

Now I see what the problem is. The Mate3 is reporting the battery voltage is 0.0V.

The system is working fine other than this. The green/yellow/red LED's on the Mate seem to change appropriately given the amount of use I am undertaking but the battery voltage is not reporting correctly.

EDIT:
One of the switches was off. I rebooted the entire system and the voltage now shows up. Sorry folks. Thanks for your help.

headsavers
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:03 am
My RE system: Aquired

Just helping friend with aquired Outback components:
1- Inverter/Charger VFXR3648A

2-SOLAR CHARGER FLEX mAX 80

16-SLA BATTERY 12 VOLYS, 250AH

12-LG365Q1C-A5 365WATT SOLAR MODULES

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by headsavers » Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:10 pm

raysun wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:18 am
headsavers wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:36 am
Will the FlexMax 80 recognize the battery bank voltage and automatically set the correct parameters, like bulk, float and tricle charge ?
Might be best to start another thread so answers don't get confused. The FM80 does autosense voltage, but doesn't necessarily set the correct voltages and times for the Absorb and Float stages, which are battery dependent. Also, it will not automatically set maximum charging current for the Bulk phase, should the battery require lower than the FM80s maximum of 80A.
How do I create a new post?

headsavers
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:03 am
My RE system: Aquired

Just helping friend with aquired Outback components:
1- Inverter/Charger VFXR3648A

2-SOLAR CHARGER FLEX mAX 80

16-SLA BATTERY 12 VOLYS, 250AH

12-LG365Q1C-A5 365WATT SOLAR MODULES

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by headsavers » Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:11 pm

How do I create a new post?

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David LeBow
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Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by David LeBow » Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:14 pm

headsavers wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:11 pm
How do I create a new post?
Select the forum (not a topic in a forum) to get the forum list and then click the "New Topic" button at the top of the list.
David LeBow
Sr. Director, Software Engineering


Alpha Technologies Inc. / OutBack Power Technologies
3767 Alpha Way Bellingham WA 98226 USA
http://www.alpha.com

provo
Forum Czar
Posts: 534
Joined: Thu Jul 27, 2006 4:34 pm
My RE system: Sixteen Evergreen EC-120
(4 strings, total 1920W)
Eight Rolls S-550 (2 strings, total ~800Ah @ 24V)
One FM80
One VFXR3524A
Hub 10
Mate3s
FNDC and Trimetric
Location: Sierra foothills

Re: Charging Only From Solar

Post by provo » Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:19 pm

headsavers wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:11 pm
How do I create a new post?
The list of forums can be found by clicking on Board Index near the top of this page. Once you click on the appropriate forum for your subject, the New Topic button shows up and you click on that.

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